Sandy...another Capri "weirdity"...

[negusm]

I think I mentioned it (and I'm sure you've heard about it)

http://www.foureyedpride.com/phpBB2/vie ... 959#113959

At FEP we started a thread on the supposed "myth" or "fact" about only 96 Capri "RS" (5.0L) cars getting "solid" roofs with no ttops or sunroofs.

The "story" is that somebody back in 86 went to their Ford dealer and wanted an 86 RS (5.0L) with a "solid" roof. He was told by the dealer that he couldn't have one because asc was contracted to supply all 5.0 RS cars for 86 with TTops or sunroofs....however, Ford finally said they were going to make a batch of 96 solid roof RS 5.0L cars....

I called BS (not in so few words)...and a thread was started and we've been keeping track of VINs as people posted them...and its sort of interesting....I think it disproves the story but also proves that there is something to it as well.

Here is the list:
604168
611770
612226
612598
612436
612729
613303
615559
615561
615690
616461
617658
617699
620635

There does appear to be a void below 611770....have you ever heard that maybe the first half of 86 required the sunroof or ttop option? Maybe the first car on that list is part of that mythical 96...and all the other ones came after the "ban" was lifted?

Just weird....thought you or others might be interested.

-Mike

[Sandy]

Oh Boy.

There was no restrictions or demands on RS cars of 1986 to have (or not have) a Pop-Up Manual Sun Roof, and/or a T-Roof. Both were stand alone options. I think some people at FEP are trying to make a story from sand. However.... and I have to find my information on this, back in the deep dark folds of me brain, I do recall a promotion for T-Tops involving the 6 CYL GS Capri of either 1985 or 1986 or both. A goupe of options at either a reduced cost .... or free.

[negusm]

Well the story is quoted like thus:

When I ordered my 86 5.0 in oct of 1985 they didn't want to build the car. They kept asking me to take a t-roof or sun roof. I didn't want one. Seems they had a deal with ASC to install roofs in all capris. My owner of this dealership went to dearborn in Jan. 1986 and asked why are you not building this car? Ford cam back a couple days latter and said they would build the 96 that were ordered in one run and never build another one w/o a sun roof or t-tops. So this is how I know mine is one of 96.

What I find weird is how there is only one vin under 611000....this is for 5.0L cars....no 4cyl or 6cyl car vins are in that list I gave you.

Like I said....weird....

-Mike

[Sandy]

Another flaw...
American Sun Roof did not do the sun roofs or T-Tops in the 1979-1986 Capris or Mustangs. Richard Chrysler's Company, "Cars and Concepts" of Brighton, Michigan did !! FoMoCo was under contract wih them. They also did the 1983-1986 Mustang Convertibles !! Why then, would this person's ordering dealer make a trip to American Sun Roof? They had nothing to do with it. Further, unless this dealer was a local (Michigan) why would he make "a trip" there, when they all have "Deler Only" HOTlines, to reach them on. Therefore, I cannot see said dealer "traveling" more than, perhaps 10 miles or so, to the American Sun Roof factory, where he'd been shown the door anyhow, as they didn't make these!!

Now, if you refer to the copies of the Dealer Price guide that I photocopied and sent, which are on this site herein, turning to the 1984 edition - dated June 4 1984, page 55 therein, you'll see the then new "Value Improvement Package(s)", for Capri GS; RS; and RS Turbo cars. Attention pointed to the RS will show that code 242C (VIP Coding "C") includes the T-Top option. This would also be VIP Coding "2". Ordering such would result in a savings of $972.00 (not exactly pocket change), which again would represent absolutely free the T-Roof.
( http://www.ascmclarencoupe.com/Literatu ... de_029.jpg )
Now, the items in the Rapid Spec Group, as you can see are items that became Standard Equipment in 1985 & continued so for 1986. This is the only Rapid-Spec listing that I can point you to, as in 1985 & 1986 the included equipment, restrictions, requirements and pricing was NOT included in the dealer price books & forms, but rather on "Dealer Only" letter-type notifacations, which we don't have.
BUT, you can be sure what happened in this case was that there was some option the buyer(s) ...(96, if that's true) did not want, that was included in the Rapid Spec Value program, thereby deleting the discount. 99% of all orders, due to the savings, would be so ordered, and the assembly line would naturally be set up for the expected landslide of conforming orders. Therefore, that would be the explanation as to why they really delayed or didn't wanna build the car to his specs. Or held it off to run thru the odd balls in a group. No dealer could be competitive with in stock, unsold Capris NOT ordered under the program! Obviously! I do not have the mandatory options for the 1986 program to figure out what might have been EXcluded or INcluded - nor what the restrictions might have been.
Possibilities would be:
Automatic Transmission; Air Conditioning; Power Lock Group; Premium Stereo; and/or Speed Control.
Since the majority of RS cars had been ordered as 5-Speed manual tranny cars, perhaps he ordered Automatic, voiding the Rapid Spec Discount Program, or.... perhaps the oppisite, them wanting to blow out excess factory inventory of Automatic Tranny(s) in stock.
It's near impossible to 2nd guess what the program might have required.

Lastly (EDIT) I HAVE the # of 1986 Capri RS built in total, as well as how many of them came from the factory with the T-Top. I'll look it up a little later.......
I hate when people spread untrue stories. If repeated enough times....it becomes "TRUTH"

[negusm]

Another flaw...
American Sun Roof did not do the sun roofs or T-Tops in the 1979-1986 Capris or Mustangs. Richard Chrysler's Company, "Cars and Concepts" of Brighton, Michigan did !!

Yes, I know. I figured you would see that too

Lastly (EDIT) I HAVE the # of 1986 Capri RS built in total, as well as how many of them came from the factory with the T-Top. I'll look it up a little later.......
I hate when people spread untrue stories. If repeated enough times....it becomes "TRUTH"

That's why I initially called "BS"....as I had seen several such cases and if there were only 96 I should see no more than 1 or 2. But I agree though, there was some special dealer pricing going on...because the VINs bear out a very distinct pattern....way WAY too distinct.

I would be interested to see what numbers you have.

-Mike

[Sandy]

THE numbers:-

1986:

20,869 Total # of 1986 Capri(s) manufactured.

03,840 # that were RS
17,029 # that were GS

00,282 # of T-Tops on RS
01,252 # of T-Tops on GS
01,534 # of T-Tops on Capris when unloaded from delivery truck at dealers.

A 7.35-percent installation rate.

[negusm]

Those numbers don't feel right.

Do you have numbers on Sunroofs?

The whole idea of the FEP thread was to find non-TTop and non-sunroof cars...and by your numbers...it should never have even been an issue as we should have found cars everywhere...but the reality is the 86 5.0L TTop cars are extremely easy to locate.

Unless MOST of the GS TTop cars were built like the 5.0L cars (with sport seats and air dam).....we have not been filtering out GS vs RS (you know that other discussion)...just taking all 5.0 cars without ttops or sunroofs.

-Mike

[Sandy]

I'm sorry if they don't "feel right" ~ but, they are from Mercury Division of FoMoCo.

Manual Pop-Up Sun Roof Installation:-

2,980 on GS
0,672 on RS
3,652 Grand Total of 20,869 cars, or 17.5 %

So...... 24.85 % had some sort of hole in the roof, while 75.15 %
had a solid roof.

BTW, NO GS cars were built with "Sports Seats" ~

[negusm]

I'm sorry if they don't "feel right" ~ but, they are from Mercury Division of FoMoCo.

Yeah. I knew you were going to say that. I just don't understand why there are so many 86 RS TTop cars still around compared to the others.

-Mike

[Sandy]

It's fairly easy. Sun Roof & T-Top(ers) are usually purchased by folks just a little bit more "into" cars, than the average folk, therefore they get much better care, and tend to be more sought after down thru the years by other "car-people" who them fix them up and bring them back to "life". Hey .... look at most of the people on here & FEP, too.

Example: They sold hundreds of thousand MORE LeMans & Tempests in the 60s, yet 'ya ever see any? Compared to 64-69 G.T.O.s ???

[negusm]

Yeah....I can see that...

Someday a stack of dealer literature will turn up and explain alot of these things...

-Mike

[75coug]

Example: They sold hundreds of thousand MORE LeMans & Tempests in the 60s, yet 'ya ever see any? Compared to 64-69 G.T.O.s ???

And it seems like 90% of the surviving Tempests have been turned into Goat clones.

[Sandy]

Yeah....I can see that...

Someday a stack of dealer literature will turn up and explain alot of these things...

-Mike

I seriously doubt it. Dealers are worse than Mothers when it comes to throwing stuff out. End of the year I used to take tons of stuff, and no matter where I was, they were like agast that I would even WANT it!
Color Chip Charts, Dealer Bullitans, left over brochures, color & trim & product knowledge showroom books, you name it & I took it. Once they threw out alot of stuff on a day I was out. Following day I was in the dumpster ruminging around!
Dealers are not savers!!

[n20capri]

Ray (7DMACH1) had an 86 with no t-top or sunroof...The burgundy car in these pics...I posted at FEP too

[Sandy]

I like that white one ! Not an ascMcLaren, but darn nice !!!!!
Red, White & Blue Capris